Jennifer Lyon Bell: 'In porn, I'm looking for that authentic moment.'

'Why is showing nudity or sex in a film always such an issue anyway?' The question was raised in passing by one of the introducers at the opening night of Cinema Erotica, the programme with which EYE ushers in the summer. This ode to lust offers a broad overview of the ways in which cinematic eroticism can take shape. From early 20th-century scabrous films from the waiting rooms of a French brothel to Fassbinder's homoerotic swan song Querelle (1982) and the camp homage The Love Witch (2016). From Asta Nielsen's rumoured sensual dance in Afgrunden (1910) via Dutch exposure to the brand new, literally nothing-concealing virtual reality production Viens! as icing on the cake.

In short, everything from porn to art. Following Afgrunden Jennifer Lyon Bell - independent filmmaker and director of erotic films - will make a valiant attempt on Saturday porn and art linking them together. From her own hand is the surprising Headshot (2006), proving that you can make porn without a single second of explicit imagery. So I want to know all about that first when I speak to her at EYE.

Erotic experiment

In it on Andy Warhol's Blow Job (1964) inspired Headshot a curious young man wonders what awaits him. A young woman he meets for the first time enters. We see only a glimpse of her back, before she bends her knees and disappears from view. The camera remains pointed steadfastly above the belt. What the woman plays out we can only read on the face of the finally ecstatically cumming Chris.

How did the plan to do it this way come about. What is the idea behind it?

Jennifer Lyon Bell: "Headshot Is an experiment with empathy. What interests me a lot is how empathy works, especially in erotic films. How people conceive empathy for the characters. I'm very curious about that. Empathy means sharing a protagonist's experience and feelings, getting to know them from the inside, so to speak. That is different from sympathy. When you conceive sympathy you look at someone as an outsider. Your feelings need not be his or her own."

"I wanted to play with those notions. I wanted to find out whether Chris' sexual enjoyment creates a bond."

Would we have stayed more at a distance if we could have actually seen the sexual acts?

"Indeed, I wanted to know if that is the case."

After which she laughingly confesses that it was actually not a good experiment, as she would have had to make two versions.

Stimulating fantasy

"Judging from the many reactions from viewers, I dare say it is a very intimate experience. Not only do you sympathise with Chris, but you also empathise strongly with what he is experiencing at that moment. On top of that, your imagination is greatly stimulated because you cannot see exactly what is happening."

"I was in the process of making Headshot not only inspired by Andy Warhol's Blow Job, as well as by a scene from Wayne Wang's The Center of the World, in which off-screen sex activity takes place. What exactly that is we never find out."

“Headshot is much less formalistic than Warhol's example. I was pleasantly surprised that this experiment appealed to such a wide audience. The short film Headshot has been screened at all kinds of festivals worldwide, not just specialised events. It taught me a lot about the erotic connection you can feel with a film character. You don't have to have the same sexual orientation, or be of the same gender."

American-born Jennifer Lyon Bell studied psychology at Harvard. Seventeen years ago, she moved to the Netherlands where she obtained her master's degree in film at the University of Amsterdam with a thesis on 'sympathy and empathy for characters in pornographic films'. She owns Blue Artichoke Films, a company specialising in the production of 'erotic films for people who love film'.

Hunting for the authentic moment

When did this interest in erotic or pornographic work arise?

"My whole adult life has interested me tremendously! Porn attracted me. Yet there was always very little I really loved. I always hunted for those few seconds in a porn film where I saw real chemistry between the actors. The moment when I could catch a glimpse of authenticity."

"In the long run, that was quite tiring. I was looking forward to a film that had more to offer. Surely someone would come up with that? Eventually, I started making the films I wanted to see myself."

For that master's thesis, you watched hundreds of pornographic films. What new knowledge did that provide?

"It helped me tremendously to understand what was going on. Why some porn films did something to me and others didn't. For instance, at one point, compilation porn was in vogue. Films in which only highlights were edited one after the other. I expected something from that, but the effect was just the opposite."

"Through that study, the workings of sympathy and empathy became clear to me. Those concepts are now my tools. In the erotic films I make myself, I can fall back on them when I get the feeling that something is not right. That works for all kinds of genres, documentary or feature film, with much or little explicit sex."

Forbidden fruits

But isn't it also exciting because as a viewer you are a voyeur, because you are actually watching something you are not supposed to see?

"Yes, the more you forbid something, the greater the desire to see it becomes."

So to make a film really exciting, we should actually ban it?

"Maybe so," she laughs.

"My films have indeed been banned in all kinds of countries. Matinée had been invited to compete in the Melbourne Underground Film Festival, for example. At the last minute, the Australian Film Board withdrew its permission, saying it would be too sexual. Fortunately, the festival was kind enough to organise a private screening for the jury. After which Matinée was awarded as best film, without the audience having been able to see it."

Porn and art

Now about that programme Porn Art you are presenting next Saturday. Can porn be art. So then the question first is: what is porn, and what is art?

"There are of course no set definitions for that, but I can tell you how I see it. One of the criteria for porn is what we get to see. How much sex is on screen? For others, the term porn is a socio-political qualification. The second feminist wave calls something porn if it is linked to the oppression of women. A third definition assumes intent. Is it made to excite? All these definitions vary over time and in different countries."

"Personally, I assume that at least one of the objectives of a porn film is to deliver arousal."

So is there a difference between porn and erotica?

"As far as I am concerned, there is no clearly defined dividing line between porn and erotica. Different people can react very differently to the same film. What I make myself I usually call 'explicit erotic film', but on another occasion I use the term 'feminist porn', or 'indie porn', 'alternative porn' or just 'film for adults'."

"For me, the main characteristic of eroticism is that it evokes a very corporeal and sensual, almost tangible feeling. I like that. But the term erotic has the disadvantage that it creates an expectation in some people that the images are less sexually explicit."

Erotic, or just not

On the other hand, I am now reminded of Lars von Trier's Nymphomaniac, which contains very explicit imagery but is in fact completely non-erotic.

"That's true. I also don't think Lars von Trier wanted to make an erotic film."

Doesn't that have to do with the difference between a sexy film and a film about sex?

"Yes, a great example of that for me is Shortbus. I am a big fan of the director John Cameron Mitchell who has previously Hedwig and the Angry Inch made. That one is completely non-explicit, but I still found it a very erotic film. It's all about desire and wanting someone you can't have. So I was elated when I heard he was going to make a sexually explicit film. My expectations were high. But when I Shortbus saw I discovered that he showed all those explicit sex scenes in a completely non-erotic way. It was a very interesting directorial choice, but it did break my heart. I keep fantasising about how great it would have been if he did go for eroticism."

Body and mind

Okay, so much for the relationship between porn, sex and erotica. But now for the art.

"To me, art is something that creatively prompts the viewer to respond emotionally or intellectually - or both. I am convinced that there is a great overlap between art and porn, because there is nothing that prevents the fusion of those two concepts."

"Especially in Western society, we tend to see a dichotomy in all sorts of areas. It's this or that, black or white. Historically in the West, we adhere to the separation of body and mind."

The body is porn, the mind is art.

"Exactly. But my mission as an artist is to show that this separation is nonsense. On the contrary, the two are very strongly connected. Socially, it is also much more fruitful not to portray porn as something bad, but to acknowledge that porn and sex have all kinds of manifestations and that we should encourage the exchange of ideas about them. That is better for society and better for film. We need better porn, and also films that deal with sexuality in a freer way. There is still a lot of ground to cover, but many filmmakers are reluctant to do so."

Is there a wide audience for it or is it niche?

"Honestly, when I started it, I thought it would be something for women. Higher educated women, like myself, looking for a better alternative to the usual porn. How could I have been so wrong. The interest is much broader. For a start, I had never thought of it than men would also be interested. Moreover, there are very different tastes when it comes to pornography. The audience turns out to be very mixed. Older people too, to my surprise."

Artistic practices

What can we make of the presentation Porn Art expect?

"I show all kinds of contemporary films in which the distinction between porn and art is blurred. I tell something about the different movements and artistic practices. Like playing with what you see and don't see, or adding a touch of documentary realism with spontaneous improvisations by the actors. Above all, I want to show the great diversity."

"So we start with Portuguese filmmaker Antonio da Silva who surprised me a lot with Gingers. An emotional and erotic exploration of what it means to be a redheaded gay man. It is entertaining, thought-provoking and is also very 'hot'."

"Another example is a film by Erika Lust, a highly respected name in the world of adult cinema. From her, I will have Meow Kittens Orgy see. That one is part of a series based on confessions written by people who write to her. Someone sent her a fantasy about a group of women who are simultaneously cats and have a playful and occasionally combative and sexual relationship with each other. Erika translated that into a charming, stunningly beautiful and super-sexy film. Very nice that I can present it."

Your own erotic fantasy

On 18 June, towards the end of Cinema Erotica, Lyon Bell will host another workshop lead under the slogan 'Design your Own Erotic Film'. What will happen there?

"The idea is to stimulate creative energy, to have fun, to open up and exchange ideas in a safe environment. You're probably never going to make a porn film yourself, but imagine if you did. What then is the one fantasy you would like to film. During these exercises, you will learn something about yourself, your erotic sensitivity and your creativity. At the end of the afternoon, you walk out the door with a storyboard for that imaginary film. At previous workshops, it has even happened that someone actually went and made it, although that is not the intention."

On that occasion, there will also be an exclusive preview of Lyon Bells Second Date (2017), an erotic film in Virtual Reality. A light-hearted, improvised narrative about two young people who, as their conversation jumps back and forth, are awkwardly but exuberantly on their way to climax. "They keep their underwear on," promises the director, "but it will still be very exciting."