Over 70% of the talking heads on TV are men, Simone van Saarloos told us in the introduction to her own talk show. Niña Weijers and she thought that surely something like this could be done better, without talking about glass ceilings and other women's topics. And so, in October 2013, they launched their sexist talk show series with guests from the arts, literature, politics and science. A year and a half later, they have become such a household name that the Holland Festival invited them for a special edition.
In the Shaffy hall of Felix Meritis, it was swelteringly hot. A huge fan buzzed so loudly that the women on stage could hardly be heard. The acoustics could be better. But the guests, Christiane Jatahy and Cigdem Yuksel made up for a lot. Both joined us because they are featured in the Holland festival with work. From Yuksel, this month's performance hangs No More Without You linked photographs in Amsterdam tram and bus shelters. Reason for a conversation about art, life and distance. "Excuseman" Mano Bouzamour was allowed to comment from the sidelines from time to time.
Cigdem Yuksel talked about her work and her Turkish background. The performance and her pictures are about refusing to be alienated from your origins and your parents while living your own life. About the oppressive We feeling and the social pressure to be a 'normal' person, lest neighbours and family exclude you. In Yukel's own life, this became a pressing issue when she wanted to move to Amsterdam on her own to become a photographer. That was absolutely not done for her parents, but she persevered and now has her own life and career. And she no longer refuses to be a part of her family. Yuksel is still in touch with her parents, but things are not going smoothly. She shows the same struggle with her photos. Hats off to this strong lady.
It is different for Mano Bouzamour, who went his own way but was consequently evicted from the house by his parents. On the evening of his appearance at Pauw and Witteman, after his successful launch of The promise of Pisa, he found his belongings on the street. Gone intoxication. Distancing, the theme of the evening, is a daily reality for him.
Second guest, Brazilian director Christiane Jatahy was quizzed on her idea of utopia and the connection between the personal and the political. She readily agreed to make political performances. She cited French philosopher Jacques Ranciere, who argues that art and politics cannot exist without each other. Her performance is an adaptation of Chekhov's Three Sisters: What If They Go To Moscow? Central questions in it are why we always want to be somewhere else. What do people dream of? She is concerned with removing boundaries, one of her own utopian desires. Jatahy lifts the boundary between theatre and film: in one room, actresses and actors play the show, which is streamed live in the other room. The audience can choose which reality they want to see first.
It was a beautiful evening. The conversations were not smooth and fast, but slightly meandering and as warm as the upstairs room in Felix. It's easy to criticise that it was on the messy side. That the interviews could be tighter and more to the point. But would that really make for more interesting conversations? I doubt it. The big advantage of a looser approach is that all the women, and the excuse man, were able to keep talking and tell their stories. Come to terms with that 70%.
Good to know:
No More Without You can still be seen on 17 June
What If They Went To Moscow can be seen on 14 and 15 June
English (UK) 
Nederlands 
Français 
