[View the story "Art world no longer trusts politics " on Storify ]
Art world no longer trusts politics
Halbe Zijlstra wouldn't mind becoming state secretary of culture again, he said at the end of his 'statement', but that was only meant as a joke. Just as there was little really serious about the Paradiso debate, the now traditional political closing of the Amsterdam Uitmarkt.
Storified by Cultural Press Agency - Mon, Aug 27 2012 06:45:36
Just a reference to our comments on the tendentious way in which the Volkskrant publicised the Berenschot study, which is at the heart of this afternoon.
Today at 16:00 debate at Paradiso 'Windfall cuts': bricks spared, people sacrificed https://cultureelpersbureau.nl//2012/08/meevallende-bezuinigingen-bakstenen-gespaard-mensen-geofferd/ via @cultuurpersCultural Press Office
'Windfall cuts culture': bricks saved, people sacrificedCultural Press OfficePainfully simple: municipalities may spend a lot of money on things under the arts budget, but over 90% of that money goes after...
And there we go.
Feels weird anyway. Being at Paradiso during the day... #paradisodebatMinke
The audience behaved nicely towards Halbe Zijlstra, who was now closing his 'Hol of the Lion' tour after Lowlands at Paradiso. Only decent people there.
No booing at halbe Zijlstra #Paradisode debateBram de Kleine
The Sttaas secretary who managed to win the hatred of the cultural Netherlands in two years was cheerful and full of bravado, a bit like we know from the VVD: neurolinguistic programming, it is called: bring your message powerfully, that convinces. It didn't quite work in Paradiso.
#paradisodebat halbe zelf: kans groot dat ik volgende debat niet haal -applaus!Martin Verbeet
http://yfrog.com/h6nnhnoj Zijlstra opens the debate with a joke. No stas next year. Will give visionCultural Press Office
paradiso debate 1: Halbe Zijlstra on his policy culture press office
paradiso debate 2: Halbe Zijlstra on the Give campaigncultural press office
#halbezijlstra speaking during
#paradisodebat On cultural policy http://pic.twitter.com/DbXF7ZmpAnnelies de Bruine
Halbe Zijlstra, also at 't
#paradisodebat , does not expect to return as secretary of state for culture 1TP5Jubilation rises from the hallGéke Roelink
Zijlstra was indeed not hoping for a post on Culture. He gaar for Exconomic Affairs, or even Finance. Or some other department where - beet listening to the field - is required for tough interventions.
Support for art subsidy system had been eroding for some time, according to Zijlstra. Experts no longer call the shots.Cultural Press Agency
This statement by Zijlstra was typical. He argued that expert opinion was no longer normative in the allocation of subsidies, but that it was now with objective criteria. And that public and market had become important. Moreover, he cheered on his own (failed) giving law that ensured that besides a gift to Africa or the local sports club, jhe gift to the 'charity' 'culture' could also be deducted a bit more.
#paradisodebat zijlstra: alles moet komen van sponsoring, kunst loopt achter bij andere goede doelenfransien v d putt
#paradisodebat ’12 Zijlstra “bezuinigingen hebben schok opgeroepen, begrijpelijk, maar ook nieuwe energie gegeven..” laat debat maar beginnenNathalie@beeldmakers
So there will be bracelets that allow you to indicate that you are 'for culture', Eng.
compatriots, buy plastic bracelets to support arts and culture! #paradodebatePaul Keller
Cultural education comes off worst in the stacked cuts by the state, provinces and municipalities, Berenschot later figures. But by then the state secretary had left.
Zijlstra thinks cultural education is very important #paradise debateThe Boiler House
paradiso debate 3: Halbe Zijlstra on arts educationcultural press office
That makes the conclusion very simple.
"Don't ask what government can do for you. For the future of arts, trust you're own creativity." Culture Min Halbe Zijlstra #paradisode debateJuha van 't Zelfde
At
#paradisodebat Zijlstra says he does have vision. That may be so, but it is certainly not always careful...Rijksmuseum Twenthe
paradiso debate 4: Zijlstra explains that national government does not have to do anything with municipalitiescultural press office
Zijlstra considers himself successful as secretary of state.
#paradisodebat #jaiemandmoetdatvindenGéke Roelink
paradiso debate 5: Halbe Zijlstra would do it again in a heartbeat cultural press office
Zijlstra homo economicus:no problem that local/national are not aligned. Enmassively buying bracelets... #paradodebateAnnelies de Bruine
And when asked by moderator Ruben Maes, Silstra then uttered the threat that he would love to be Culture Secretary again. But he laughed a little too hard at it.
Zijlstra would be happy to do it for another four years.Cultural Press Agency
http://yfrog.com/h3l10llj bastiaan vinkenburg berenschot: his presentation is now online at site berenschot.Cultural Press Office
Presentation Berenschot Paradiso Debate 2012: http://prezi.com/xxifwhbzx-es/het-culturele-landschap-vanaf-2013/Peter Joziasse
We will let the numbers speak for themselves for a moment
The cultural landscape from 2013 onwards by Gilmar Pattipeilohy on PreziPresentation by Bastiaan Vinkenburg, Berenschot, at the Paradisode debate on Sunday 26 August 2012
prezzi: perfect for when you want to turn a boring presentation into an irritating one... #paradisodebatPaul Keller
And the summary:
#paradisodebat rijk: bezuinigt 24%, gemeenten 19%, vertaalt naar podiumrijk: 33%, gemmentenmaar 7%fransien v d putt
#paradisodebat grote afname voorstellingen van 6500 naar 5000!Martin Verbeet
#paradisodebat verschillen tussen gemeenten: utrecht: hoogste budget per inwoner voor kunst, groningen en maastricht doen t ook goedfransien v d putt
And then Halbe Zijlstra left the room, because otherwise he would have to debate with representatives of lower authorities.
Irony: culture minister snubs public debate with art world in favour of political campaign in real world #paradisode debateJuha van 't Zelfde
Halbe Zijlstra just did a Francesco Schettino and abandoned the
#paradisodebat prematurelyJuha van 't Zelfde
And once again an alderman (from Amsterdam) told how important it all was.
Carolien Gehrels (Amsterdam) gives figures showing why it is good to invest in arts and culture #paradiseisode debateRijksmuseum Twenthe
What a glaring difference: Gehrels makes a case for art and culture, Zijlstra only talks about numbers/spending cuts #paradisode debateGéke Roelink
"Without art and culture n city dies" says Carolien Gehrels #paradise debateThe Ketelhuis
Pity that real discussion between Gehrels and Zijlstra does not take place, now statess has left earlier #paradodebateFemke van Woerden-T
Next secretary of state should have a talk with the cultural sector. Did #Zijlstra simply not do so, and I am being mild. #paradise debateJetta Klijnsma
Paradiso debate 7: Jetta Klijnsma promises Labour Party to do more for arts cultural press office
The CDA, meanwhile, continues to support cabinet policy.
#paradisodebat : totaal subsidie #cultuur zakt van 5,25 naar 4,75 mrd. Giga geld! Sector blijft boos maar zou nieuwe rol moeten pakken #CDAMarieke van der Werf
And the VVD warns that the worst is yet to come.
#paradisodebat Mark Harbers waarschuwt voor nieuwe bezuinigingen voor gemeenten, 10% extra, en vreest dat kunst dan opnieuw geraakt wordt.jan zoet
paradiso debate 6: Mark Harbers (VVD) in debate with Onno Hoes (VVD)cultural press office
Although there is also a VVD member who thinks differently: mayor Onno Hoes of Maastricht. But that doesn't count for much, because once in The Hague, mayors of Maastricht think very differently about their policies.
Onno Hoes calls for process agreements on support and pluralism in policy in interim period until new cabinet.
#paradisodebat #contentMariël Voogel
New significant term "co-governments" instead of lower authorities #paradodebateRijksmuseum Twenthe
#paradisodebat Hoes: aan beleid Zijlstra ontbrak overleg, en ontbrak groeimodelfransien v d putt
There followed another presentation on the European investment plan for culture, which promised an increase in the culture budget but did not materialise:
Europe increases creative sector budget by 37%.pvv and vvd oppose. The reports marietje schaake the on #paradise debateCultural Press Office
Annual
#Paradisodebat on culture during
#Uitmarkt . Curious if there will be any surprising election positions http://pic.twitter.com/gWuiWG2TChantal Hatchet
And then it became an election debate.
Clear language from @markharbers
#VVD #paradisodebat ; # culture sector needs to take even stronger ownership.Pieter Heiliegers
GreenLeft goes for repairs damage Zijlstra and strengthen sector #culture #value #paradise debateCorinne Ellemeet
CDA did not want to increase European budget because it did not fit domestic cuts. Would be weird that stand. #paradodebateCultural Press Agency
#D66 roept in
#paradisodebat on giving more culture money to Europe = beyond reality if in NL companies have to stop.Marieke van der Werf
@mariekecda pleads on
#paradisodebat For "new images". That's the future of culture! #museumvdverbeeldingRijksmuseum Twenthe
"With snippet v EU agricultural subsidies going to arts & culture, the sector is greatly helped by that" says @MarietjeD66 to @CDA #paradisodebatMarc van der Ham
Robert van Leer rightly says in angry American: not enough talk about the future yet #paradodebateAnnelies Oudshoorn
#Paradisodebat @mariekecda benoemt inzet van revolverend fonds naast subsidie om ondernemerschap te stimuleren.Bart van Meijl
Pity, mn discussion government funding. Question is mi not who invests most, but contributes most to resilience #paradodebatChantal Hakbijl
Arts sector representatives listen to political spokesmen. Do I see distance?
#paradisodebat http://pic.twitter.com/zkUDeM50Frits Lintmeijer
What can art makers and politics give each other? Best question at
#paradisodebat @artists92 1TP5GivingLaw2.0 Art shapes future NL!Marleen Brewer
Finally the conversation is turned around; we don't need to receive from politics, what does politics want from us? Go Michiel #paradisodebatradna
Question poorly understood, means politics should consider artists as thinkers & entrepreneurs ipv entertainers #paradisodebatradna
Flinty fittie now between sp , vvd and PvdA over role of government in talent development #paradisode debateWijbrand Schaap
VVD during
#paradisodebat : VVD also favours art! 'Surely 80% subsidy remains'The Boiler House
See here the
#D66 election programme in the field of # culture
#paradisodebat https://www.d66.nl/?start=20&s=CultuurMarietje Schaake
Jetta Klijnsma rightly points out role of artists as R&D department of society #paradodebatePaul Keller
SP during
#paradisodebat : SP wants to reverse 200 million culture cutsThe Ketelhuis
And
#SP is going to allocate 200 mio extra for culture. Is not in election manifesto, no one who't believe. #paradodebateMarieke van der Werf
Come along some spectacular promises of politics on
#paradisodebat . The sector is reacting sceptically.Cultural Press Agency
Realism is lacking in
#paradisodebat How to deal with coming economic malaise? Verdict: away from dependence on politics.douwe jan joustra
Wholeheartedly AGREE with @michielviersel at
#paradisodebat . Connect arts and culture to other pol. policy areas. Anchor and valorise!Marleen Brouwer
Valve
#paradisodebat , message to politicians: RT @museummeister Jet de Ranitz: If you set the frames, we will colour outside the lines.Cultural Press Agency
Jet de Ranitz: "Culture sector wants to be - and already is - entrepreneurial - but not if that is a euphemism for austerity." #paradodebateMarijn vBallegooijen
@inekevosman Everyone in the Culture Sector: do your own thing, avoid politics and address your audience directly #paradise debateIneke Vosman
Politics has become insecure partner in culture. Conclusion of #paradise debateWijbrand Schaap
@frxnsien @wijbrand
#paradisodebat Had that conclusion been reached a little earlier, the damage might have been limited.Alper Çuğun
I found
#Paradisodebat disappointing. Cluttered and poorly structured. And again the cultural sector versus politics. Pity.Arjen Pels Rijcken
What was also unfortunate about the
#Paradisodebat , there was no opportunity for networking. We were immediately evicted from the hall after debate. @JetdeRanitzArjen Pels Rijcken
@HalbeZijlstra would do it again; politicians promise more money, hall doesn't really believe it
#Paradisodebat @Kunsten92Jet de Ranitz
English (UK) 
Nederlands 
Français 