Choreographer Ernst Meisner (1982) is artistic coordinator of the Junior Company of the Dutch National Ballet and artistic director of the National Ballet Academy. As a former dancer, he knows that you have to get out of the rehearsal studio, onto the stage. That is why he makes sure his dancers and dancers-in-training keep dancing in front of an audience as much as possible, even if the performances are online because of corona.
'I danced when I was four years old; I was very shy and then I didn't need to talk. After the seven-year preparatory training at the National Ballet Academy in Amsterdam, I went to London for the higher professional training at the Royal Ballet School. After just a few months, I was offered a job as a dancer with the Birmingham Royal Ballet. I spent a Christmas break at home mulling that over and then took the gamble of turning down the job. My classmates declared me crazy, but after a year I was hired at The Royal Ballet. Being accepted into the premier league of ballet was a dream come true.'
Disappointment
'When I auditioned for the Stuttgart Ballet, Marijn Rademaker walked away with the job. I was so disappointed by that, when I got on the plane back home alone. But I know it's part of the job. As a dancer in a company, I am often disappointed: roles you don't get or promotion you don't make at the moment when you feel you have already achieved a lot. The 'cast list' showing who gets which role in a production is a gauge of the level of a dancer. It didn't happen very often that the 'cast list' said exactly what I was hoping for. Dealing with that is part of the dance profession, but it's still difficult, even if you've been doing it for 20 years.'
'At The Royal Ballet, we had choreographic workshops or evenings when dancers were allowed to make their own things. At the time, they had just built new studios and a studio theatre, 'Clore Studio Upstairs'. In the beginning, that was not professionally programmed, so that was a great creative space that we were allowed to occupy ourselves. We devised evenings in between the busy schedule of 130 performances a year that we danced. In our own time, we created our own work. It was a very beautiful time. That space was there, but it hadn't been filled in like that and we really had the freedom to do it ourselves.'
Choreography
'Choreography is different for each project and process. The best thing is that I can put a piece of myself in it, that I can share how I stand in something and what I believe in. I make choreographies that I think someone else should really see or feel or experience. This can range from a statement to conveying a beautiful feeling. For me, choreographing is even more personal than dancing myself. A choreographer cannot hide behind anything. The dance performance, that is who you are, that's it.’
'It takes time to learn choreography. I think in the beginning, like many beginning choreographers, I was busy finding steps and a dance language. As I get older, I react more to the people I work with and think it out less in advance. This results in unusual creations, such as Narnia: a mix of ballet and hip-hop.'
'How I choreograph is different every time. Sometimes the music is the starting point and I translate it through the steps and movement, as I feel and believe it. But if you want to tell an existing, written story, as I did with choreographer and artistic director Marco Gerris of ISH in the adaptation of the fairy tale Grimm have done, you have a completely different starting point. Then that existing story has to be put down clearly by the dancers, then that's your quest: that that storyline is right.'
'I can also say: something is happening in society and I think something about it and then that is the starting point of a choreography. Then I think up dance movements that express that, I make a movement language that fits that message.'
Time
'A matter of a tight schedule and prioritising. I am artistic director of the Junior Company and of the National Ballet Academy (NBA). Those two jobs fit well together and are an extension of each other. I can switch well from teaching ballet to a meeting. But choreography is really a different thing. It requires a reflective state of your mind; you really need time for that. I try to fill my schedule so that there is really space, including thinking space and empty space where even thinking is not necessary; for choreography, that is important. What works for me is an empty studio in the evening where I turn on the music and then walk around for a hundred hours.'
'We live in such a weird time because of corona that we are constantly developing and learning how to deal with the constraints. For example, we have had to bring the ballet classes online. The big challenge with that is that for the dancers, even if it's not live, we have to offer as many things as learning to choreograph themselves, studio presentations and online performances for audiences. To keep that feeling that comes with a performance, because that's what the profession is about. It's not about rehearsing in the studio. That's part of it, but it has to culminate in a live performance. At some point you're done rehearsing and you have to go on stage. You have to keep building in moments like that, even if it is more difficult while respecting coronagraphs.'
Ted Brandsen
'I have a number of people around me who I can always ask questions and submit things to. In recent years, definitely Ted Brandsen has been a mentor. He has given me a lot of opportunities. He awarded me a big and sought-after commission at a very young age - I was 31 - with founding the Junior Company. He gave me a lot of freedom in how I wanted to arrange and organise it, both in terms of practical and artistic content. He also gave me feedback and feedforward on that.'
'I enjoy both my jobs immensely. To work every day with so many people with so much energy, who believe in something and are dedicated. I don't like routine, which is why I stopped dancing at the time; I like to innovate and keep going. I enjoy developing myself further by leading a group and working with young dancers. To be on the other side of the business after my own dance career, that's something I've always wanted to do.'
Leadership style
'What mine is, you actually have to ask someone else. I hope I give space to other people to do their jobs and their desires as best as they can. I see it as my job to provide a platform from which they can work and develop as best they can. Really filling in every little thing is not possible and I don't want to. The right platform is different for everyone and that is adjusting every time, but that is what I would hope to achieve. Especially in consultation and to do it together. Since working at the NBA, I have been going through a change in that myself. I hope to give more space to other people to find the space for themselves.'
Diversity
'Diversity of dancers on stage is very important to me. We should be a representation for and of the world. The ballet world is really still making strides in that. That means working with people from different backgrounds and providing opportunities for that. For example, we always want guys who dance, we have to pull and do our best for that. The Billy Elliot-film and musical a few years ago helped enormously in getting boys excited. Their background is also important. We have a nice partnership from the city centre with dance school Motion Dance in Southeast, which has helped us get more diverse students in school. We have some very nice examples of success stories with dancer Michaela DePrince, who started in the Junior Company, and Sedrig Verwoert who has now been appointed as young creative associate. That helps; when you are young you have to have examples. That you look at someone and think: you can do this and I can do this too. That gives hope to a young person.'
Relevant
'Ballet should relate to what is happening in the world. It doesn't have to be the same everywhere. I would love it if a company here is very different from a company in London or in New York or in Paris. That you really have your own voice. Swan Lake will always be there for every company in different variations. But besides that, there is a lot of room to have just that own voice in companies.'
'Over the last 20 years, the big companies started to look a bit alike, as they liked to associate the same big-name choreographers. Now, on the contrary, there is a tendency to make one's own voice important again and to look for ourselves who are with us and around us. Who are relevant to us. That only makes it more interesting for everyone: for the dancer, for us and for the audience.'
Wish
'I wish I was sitting in a theatre auditorium at some point in a red plush seat with other people to the left and right. In a packed auditorium where the excited murmur is heard before the start of a performance. Where the lights dim and the curtain rises and my young dancers appear on stage.'
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